Why We Can’t Beat The Vegans To It

They Did It Again

The Game Changer movie is out and is sweeping through the minds of men of all ages! Yep, they will try the vegan diet because of the penis part of the movie. I am not going to talk about the penis story. It was the highlight of the movie in the eyes of all men for sure!

There is nothing better than to appeal to the ego when we want to sell a story (or an expensive car or purse or jewelry). Humans seem to live for being different from thy neighbors. While a designer purse or red convertible are likely to catch the eyes (not heart) of a young female beauty on the street, getting more and bigger erections (while sleeping and you have no clue about them) may be an equally provocative eye-catcher for men. I am not a man so just guessing here.

Any Truth to the Story?

Nope, not one bit of truth to any of what was in the film. However, I find that most attacks on the film get nowhere–not even with me, who really thinks the film is recruiting the gullible, clueless, and vulnerable into the vegan movement. One cannot prove that the vegan diet is unhealthy by showing that eating meat is essential. To prove that the vegan diet is unhealthy, one must prove that the foundation on which it stands is false.

Since the film is long and I am thinking about writing a bigger article on this, here I just want to bring light to one key area that stopped me in my tracks while watching the movie.

Gladiators and the Vegan/Vegetarian Diet

I was absolutely shocked to hear that the purported benefits to athletes from eating the vegan diet is based on the “fact” that gladiators ate a vegan/vegetarian diet. The idea came from this paper, which visits a few grave sites of “gladiators” in Turkey. I placed gladiators in quotes because there are two widely understood categories of fighters (also mentioned in the article): those that were meant to die, such as slaves and prisoners, and those that were meant to win, such as the trained gladiators.

Reading this article, it is clear that most gladiators found in the graves were the slaves and the prisoners. Of course, one would not expect that they would get any great food; they were meant to die. The graves of these gladiators contained women and children as well. And yep, their bone study, via various isotopes, revealed that they mostly ate grains and beans.

The other gladiators, the ones that were supposed to win, were in different graves. There were two distinct groups in this particular paper–mind you only a handful of true gladiators, so not sure how we can make any judgment of the entire era of gladiators and all gladiators from this one site in Turkey, and the few bodies found there. Anyhow, of the two groups, one group was “local” and one was from somewhere else–origin unknown but differences were established based on the food isotopes in the bones. One of these non-local gladiators was a woman by the way.

So What Did They Find In The Bones?

Many things. The most prominent item they found was ash. Ash, according to archaeological knowledge, was in a drink made from herbs and ash, which was drank in great quantity by professional gladiators. It was believed to have had healing properties for fast recovery from wounds and muscle fatigue. They also found isotopes indicating grains (barley was typical) and beans and other pulses, often peas. They state the following:

“…supported by stable isotopes data, that the diet of the group with the high Sr/Ca-ratio consisted of both low-Ca vegetable food and green plants providing high Ca and Sr levels. The group with the low Sr/Ca was assumed to have had a clearly Ca-enriched diet including a considerable amount of milk and dairy products that supply the organism with highly bio-purified Ca…”

Ok … milk??? So being vegan is out. Now let’s see more information.

“The female from the gladiator cemetery (EPH-DAM 72/93 rFEM-1) and one gladiator (EPH-DAM 248/93 rFEM 6) show extraordinary d34S values of more than 10%(Fig. 4), another gladiator shows d34S values close to 10% ( 9.7% EPH-DAM 187/ 93 r FEM 2). All other individuals have lower sulphur ratios which mean that they can basically be assigned to terrestrial ecosystems. Both individuals with values higher than 10% had probably migrated from another geographical region and/or they consumed more fish and seafood than the others.” (emphasis by me)

Ohhhh ok.. so fish… what about meat?

“15dN values also indicate a generally minor consumption of animal proteins, like meat and dairy products.” [15dN is nitrogen and would represent meat]

And the most interesting sentence in the paper is this:

“…the most probable cause for the depletion of 15dN could have been a frequent consumption of legumes…”

Huh? What this means: If you eat lots of pulses like beans and lentils, which were the staple in that area at that time, traces of animal protein consumption would become depleted.

So Were The Gladiators Vegetarian/Vegan?

It is not possible to demonstrate that the gladiators didn’t eat meat. Even in modern nutrition science there is quite a bit of discussion about the presumed benefits of plants chock full of antinutrients, such as lectins, phytates, and a host of others, which block animal protein absorption, prevent nutrient absorption and, if not enough meat is consumed, protein (or its consumption records) may be depleted(1)(2). Therefore, we cannot tell if the gladiators ate or didn’t eat meat–some certainly ate fish and most drank milk. This excludes veganism 100%.

Having a movie made–which I must admit is amazingly done by non-other than James Cameron, an Academy Award winning filmmaker, known for movies like The Titanic and Avatar–on false premises is a major oops.

Will the majority of people know about the false premise? Nope. Will they inquire about the premise? Nope. They will believe because it is in a film! Right?


So why can’t we beat the vegans to it? Because to make a film of success, we must focus on how it looks and feels and not what it says or how true what it says is. The entire vegan movement is based on lies and look at the number of followers.

So what are we, enlightened ones, to do? Nothing… The only thing we could do is pay millions to James Cameron to produce a movie about eating LCHF, or carnivore, or keto, hire on famous athletes, movie stars, etc. We also need to make sure first that we give Cameron shares in products we eat to encourage some financial benefits long term. After all, he and his wife are the founders of Verdiant Foods, an organic pea protein company.

It also would help if we had some sort of a religious organization behind us like there is behind the vegans. Most funds are put up by the Seventh-day Adventists in support of all vegan agenda; after all they are the founders of the vegan movement and they wish to spread their religion around the world. Veganism is a religion. Just like any other religion, its goal is to increase its membership, to do away with all other religions, and make everyone Seventh-day Adventist. The vegan diet is just a tool. People who follow the diet are not necessarily religious and they may not have any idea that they were captured by a religious movement.

Can science-based nutrition win over a religious-movement-based nutrition? Not any more than science can win over religion. 


  1. Effects of antinutritional factors on protein digestibility and amino acid availability in foods. Gilani GS1, Cockell KA, Sepehr E. J AOAC Int. 2005 May-Jun;88(3):967-87.
  2. Bioavailability of minerals in legumes. Sandberg AS. Br J Nutr. 2002 Dec;88 Suppl 3:S281-5.

About Angela A Stanton, Ph.D.

Angela A Stanton, PhD, is a Neuroeconomist focusing on chronic pain--migraine in particular--physiology, electrolyte homeostasis, nutrition, and genetics. She lives in Southern California. Her current research is focused on migraine cause, prevention, and treatment without the use of medicine. As a forever migraineur from childhood, her discovery was helped by experimenting on herself. She found the cause of migraine to be at the ionic level, associated with disruption of the electrolyte homeostasis, resulting from genetic variations of all voltage dependent channels, gates, and pumps (chanelopathy) that modulate electrolyte mineral density and voltage in the brain. In addition, insulin and glucose transporters, and several other variants, such as MTHFR variants of B vitamin methylation process and many others are different in the case of a migraineur from the general population. Migraineurs are glucose sensitive (carbohydrate intolerant) and should avoid eating carbs as much as possible. She is working on her hypothesis that migraine is a metabolic disease. As a result of the success of the first edition of her book and her helping over 5000 migraineurs successfully prevent their migraines world wide, all ages and both genders, and all types of migraines, she published the 2nd (extended) edition of her migraine book "Fighting The Migraine Epidemic: Complete Guide: How To Treat & Prevent Migraines Without Medications". The 2nd edition is the “holy grail” of migraine cause, development, and prevention, incorporating all there is to know. It includes a long section for medical and research professionals. The book is full of academic citations (over 800) to authenticate the statements she makes to make it easy to follow up by those interested and to spark further research interest. It is a "Complete Guide", published on September 29, 2017. Dr. Stanton received her BSc at UCLA in Mathematics, MBA at UCR, MS in Management Science and Engineering at Stanford University, PhD in Economics with dissertation in neuroscience (culminating in Neuroeconomics) at Claremont Graduate University, fMRI certification at Harvard University Medical School at the Martinos Center for Neuroimaging for experimenting with neurotransmitters on human volunteers, certification in LCHF/ketogenic diet from NN (Nutrition Network), certification in physiology (UPEN via Coursea), Nutrition (Harvard Shool of Public Health) and functional medicine studies. Dr. Stanton is an avid sports fan, currently power weight lifting and kickboxing. For relaxation (yeah.. about a half minute each day), she paints and photographs and loves to spend time with her family of husband of 45 years, 2 sons and their wives, and 2 granddaughters. Follow her on Twitter at: @MigraineBook, LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/angelaastantonphd/ and facebook at https://www.facebook.com/DrAngelaAStanton/
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62 Responses to Why We Can’t Beat The Vegans To It

  1. Roald Michel says:

    Finally here’s a nice one. And guess what? This guy is practicing in Aruba. And I met him too ☺️ Some character I tell you 👹

    Liked by 1 person

    • Good response. Though my response would be that they fight fewer infections–LDL is part of the immune system and it helps fighting pathogens. Where the Inuit and other like them live, there are fewer pathogens so less LDL is sufficient. In addition, they eat no carbs–plant form at least–and so no need for reducing oxidative damage. Their metabolism is quite different from the “modern Western” (SAD) diet so not comparable. 🙂 I don’t think low LDL is good or beneficial. It carries all fat-soluble vitamins and mineral. So having low LDL automatically means that one doesn’t have enough fat-soluble vitamins and minerals in the blood to get to where they need to get to.

      One of these days I visit you in Aruba… Hubby and I were just talking about that the other day.


  2. Roald Michel says:

    Came across this just now.

    Three snippets:
    1. “Stents and coronary artery bypass surgery are no more effective than intensive drug treatment and better health habits in preventing millions of Americans from heart attacks and death, a large study found, shedding new light on a major controversy in cardiology.

    2. “Statins and aspirin are critically important,”

    3. “The results add to an already heated debate between interventional cardiologists, who conduct stent procedures, and preventive cardiologists, who prescribe cholesterol and blood pressure-lowering drugs and changes in diet and exercise.

    A large and recent study (findings, released this Saturday at the American Heart Association’s annual scientific conference) still going with the benefits of statins and the evil coming from cholesterol? They never came to your insights about that stuff? What’s going on in this world? Swallowing the wrong food, polluting the planet, taking stupid medicines, blindly following leaders, diagnosing people like me suffering from APONS (anti-pathology-of-normalcy-syndrome), etc.

    Segítség!!! 😈

    Liked by 1 person

    • Oh dear.. you ask for help in Hungarian? 😉 lol… I know.. the world is crazy. they think this can go on forever but frankly, they can discuss and argue till cows come home, because people are starting to understand things and are stopping to listen. So they can recommend stents but no one will get it and they can recommend statins but no one will take it. And they cannot do anything about it.

      This will take some time. But there are millions already following a low carbs diet, whichever version. These people will not even go to their doctors. They take no medicines, and are healthy. This group will starve doctors for sure. And the next generation coming up is waking up. I think the baby-boomers are the last gullible and sick generation though some of us are waking up even there. The Millennia generation is fitness crazy and eats keto or CD or vegan. They are safe from this madness–maybe not the vegans fully but better than SAD. ❤


  3. Roald Michel says:

    Came across this one today
    Now I’m wondering……..how many of these so called Millennials are vegans? 😛

    Liked by 1 person

    • I don’t think this is true Roald. What is true is that people see their doctors less often but that doesn’t necessarily equate to them therefore being sicker… au contraire… they are the ones experimenting with the keto and carnivore diets, many if not most are LCHF… I think the healthcare industry is just freaking out because it doesn’t see these people but it doesn’t see them because

      1) indeed, there is no trust–no surprises there
      2) they can trust Dr. Google
      3) they are turning away from what they parents are doing–their parents are the sick ones
      4) there is a gym craze now like never before. Muscles are everything–heck even I am a weightlifter… so that also explains it.

      I think the healthcare industry will collapse once the baby boomers have all died because gen X will take all the money but the millennials will not need any help. Both of my kinds are millennial: 1981 and 1982 but right at the start. they are borderline in their understanding of the world around them in nutrition. My trainer is 32 so he is a pure millennial and that generation is 100% health and muscle conscious. I am not concerned. 🙂


    • chris c says:

      I haven’t bothered to see my doctor for a couple of years now. The bad news is that she has now left. I don’t know if she took early retirement or moved elsewhere. Now I will have to train a new one (sigh)

      Liked by 1 person

  4. Donald says:

    I don’t know if I mentioned this, but I have eleven children with my wife of thirty five years. Nine boys and two girls. We raise our own chickens, rabbits, and have a large stocked pond. Pigs and goats are next. We are in a coop to get raw milk and grass fed beef. I made it a goal to plant five fruit trees every year and now have about fifty fruit trees in our orchard. We also do a large, organic garden fertilized with chicken and rabbit manure. I’m not ready to adopt the no fruit and vegetables diet yet but I am leaning towards seeing plants as medicine rather than food and have cut my plant consumption considerably. But my point is to give you hope for the future. My children and grandchildren are being brought up eating meat and saturated fat as their main source of calories. The information is out there and I don’t think the vegans will win. They will be too weak to stop us, lol.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Don says:

      That should be co-op, lol. We’re not in a coop and neither are our chickens!

      Liked by 1 person

    • I am so glad to hear what you are doing. I wish more of us could do what you do. I eat some fruits and veggies seasonally too. 🙂 I think that’s totally fine. I am not anti-fruits at all. More anti-plant simply because of the toxins in them.

      I am sure there will be some isolated happiness (assuming they don’t destroy the planet first by a nuclear bomb). However, the world, as we know it today, will be gone. Even farms like yours may be under attack–this has happened in the history of the world and history seems to repeat. I don;t have 100% confidence.

      I sure wish more people did what you do. 🙂


      • Don says:

        Well, you know what they say. History may not repeat but it sure does rhyme.
        Whether one believes in evolution or God, it seems fruits were designed by one or the other to be eaten. I’m still debating on tubers, but I absolutely love potatoes, onions and garlic. But I’m with you on leaves and stems and seeds. They seem to be to be more medicinal and to be used in small amounts. Small amounts of toxins can have hormetic effects.
        I’m looking into bees as well. I know there are a few primitive cultures that use large amounts of honey. I don’t have a huge sweet tooth but my wife does and honey does have some beneficial properties besides just adding sweetness.
        Yes, I’m blessed and I hope my way of life can be preserved.

        Liked by 1 person

        • The problem with honey Don is that it is high fructose syrup–courtesy of the bees’ concentrating efforts. While there certainly are many tribes eating honey, we must look at everything in context. Eating honey on its own is probably fine. Eating it with fat and meat may not be fine.

          Potatoes are tubers of sorts and as such are the very roots of the plants. They contain trypsin inhibitor and lectins. Both of these interfere with the absorption of nutrients. I believe they are also high in oxalates. I would place garlic and onion into a different category from other roots, primarily because we eat them in small amount–relative to, say, potatoes.

          I don’t think that plants are on this planet as food for us. Plant preceded most animals on the planet–they are in this for themselves. This doesn’t mean we cannot eat them, but it certainly means that we should put the caution flag on all plants.

          Luckily I have no cravings of sweets. Once you quit sweets, it becomes overwhelming and stinks as well–sugar definitely has a smell. I don;t eat even naturals or substitutes. If I want to eat anything sweet, I will grab sugar–the safest option. 🙂


        • Don says:

          Yes, I will use honey in moderation. As I said, I don’t crave sweets but my wife is a different story. I’m working on it, lol.
          I’m glad to hear that about onions and garlic! I know all the downside of potatoes but I have to draw the line somewhere, lol. What’s the point of life if you can’t enjoy a few sinful pleasures. 😈 I have been boiling them and then frying them in beef tallow after refrigerating. This is supposed to increase resistant starches that feed beneficial bacteria. Could you comment on that please?

          Liked by 1 person

        • Don yes, resistant starches are great if you feel you need gut flora to do the digestion for you–no choice who digests and what if you eat plants, which is fine. The biggest problem we face is that there are no tests showing how long something has to be refrigerated or frozen before it becomes resistant starch. There is no guarantee that a refrigerated cooked potato for a night is enough.

          Grains, for example baked bread, supposedly require 1 month in the freezer to become resistance starch.

          So how long does it take for cooked potato? No idea. It is best to not count on potatoes becoming resistant starch from a short time in the fridge after cooking. However, if the starch does convert to resistant starch, the gut flora will ferment it and produce short-chain fatty acids, such as butyrate, which is a ketone precursor. For those on the carnivore diet who eat no plant matter at all, ketones are produced by the human body and nearly all of the nutrient absorption is in the small intestine. Perhaps minimal gut flora activity exists but I am unsure.

          The one thing I am sure of is that people who eat no plant matter have much more regular and healthier bowel movements than those consuming plants… food for thought. 🙂


      • chris c says:

        Animals defend themselves by fighting or running away. Plants don’t want to be eaten either so they defend themselves with toxins. Over time we have evolved to detoxify them and even use some of them as medicine, but not everyone. We breed plants for pest resistance, ie. higher toxicity, but we can’t tell them humans are not pests. (Well we are but not in the same way).

        Currently I’m eating Brussels sprouts (with or without chestnuts) and various forms of broccoli with my meat – these are the best things about winter along with the pheasants and herrings. I used to grow my own runner beans until I found people who grow them better – I don’t have much space but fortunately I can eat a lot of fresh local and seasonal food. Many of the farmers keep old breeds like yummy Hereford and Angus bulls and Gloucester Old Spot pigs which make awesome sausages – they are from before the time they were bred to be low fat. One guy has Lincoln Reds and has even sold his beef to Japan, which is next to impossible.

        My fear is that when meat is taxed it will put them out of business and if that doesn’t work they will make meat illegal, which will end all the old breeds.

        I have some memes, probably not original



        Liked by 1 person

        • I don’t see how we are pests in any different way than an insect or a caterpillar eating the plants. We do the same thing and on a massive scale.

          I am a super-taster. Normally being a super-taster is quite terrible because all tastes are amplified. As a result, I cannot eat food with spices in the food, for example. Even salt is questionable for me so I take salt in a capsule. I cannot really salt my food much–often not at all. There are benefits to being a super-taster though, and one of the benefits is the ability to tell toxin.

          I am unable to eat Brussels Sprout, spinach, and a host of other plants as a result. I also taste a bitter aftertaste of sugar. Can’t stand honey and maple syrup–not even their smell. It activates my gag reflex.

          I am also a super-smeller. I can smell type 2 diabetes and can distinguish a bacterial infection from a viral one by smell. I can also smell sugar–and the smell is not good.

          Some of these “benefits” come from the hyper-sensitive-sensory organs of the migraine brain. I have always thought these “skills” were a curse but as I get older and fully understand their functions, I have grown extremely fond of them. It can literally tell me what will kill me. I like that. I cannot eat 99% of the plants from the plant kingdom. I am able to eat fruits and some lettuce types–not all.

          I make Brussels Sprouts for my hubby–I just came home with some. I cannot go near any and also have to open all doors and windows while cooking them.


        • chris c says:

          I have to open the window after I’ve eaten the sprouts or broccoli. Here’s a clue, it isn’t meat that rots in the colon. I feel your pain being a supertaster, there aren’t many things I don’t like but some that don’t like me – apart from grains, most fruit except berries and root vegetables are too carby. They are things I used to eat but no more. I can taste the rancidity of seed oils on the now few occasions I eat out. The disaster is that I never liked eggs, either the taste or the texture. Cheese on the other hand . . .be right back . . .

          Liked by 1 person

        • I never eat anything made with any oil anywhere if I can help it. The few places I frequent all know to use butter–I also don’t use olive oil… no oil at all for me. I am heading down to San Diego next week for a conference (American Nutrition Association) where I present a poster. Hubby is coming with me and reserved already all evenings in various restaurants, all scrutinized for their menu online. I am curious if I succeed everywhere but like first night is seafood so there is no chance for any oil in raw oysters and crab legs or lobster tail, etc… And if I cannot eat anywhere, I just buy some cheese and half-and-half and survive on that for 4 days.

          In terms of eggs–I dislike eggs to the core but managed to figure a way to eat them!! And I am completely addicted to eggs this way. Have you heard of cloud bread? There is nothing bread about them but they also don;t taste like eggs. I bake that several times a week, 10-12 eggs at the time, and this way I can eat 2-4 eggs a day depending on my mood.

          To make cloud bread: separate egg whites from yolk. Beat egg whites really hard with salt. Beat egg yolks EXTREMELY–change of color and quantity like doubles–add some cream cheese (10 gr per egg)–and beat more. Slowly fold egg white into this so it remains really hard. Spoon onto buttered parchment paper if blobs and/or into muffin pans (I use the extra large muffin making pans), and bake at 350F or so for 15-25 minutes, depending on how hot your oven.

          I bake 10-12 eggs and so i refrigerate the cloud breads I don’t immediately eat. It sores very well in a plastic bag or container. I warm each in the micro before eating and grate cheddar cheese on top. I eat this with everything because it is very neutral in taste–goes well with meats, salads, and on their own.

          I was a carnivore for several months but I as so seasonally. I now moved back to keto/LCHF because keto seems to suit my health better it seems. Just looking at the particle sizes (cholesterol) I greatly changed my cholesterol profile by going from SAD to LCHF then keto then to carnivore and now back to keto/LCHF (I am in ketosis in LCHF as well).

          My general cholesterol test my doctor gives me shows little change after my change away from SAD and when triglycerides dropped to normal range. Since then the improvement in that general lipid test is insignificant though minor increase in HDL and continued decrease in triglycerides. That’s all that shows in the standard test with LDL being highest in CD and lowest in keto. But the NMR test shows the particle differences and my particle count went from high in LCHF to astronomical in CD and now to within normal after I moved back to keto/LCHF. Also my insulin score moved up and down, being worse in CD! So some stuff is interesting to follow and check if you have access to NMR.

          I finally had the chance to order a “real” NMR that also shows HDL particle sizes and I can see my HDL is smaller than it should be so working to improve that… Interesting stuff. It is particularly interesting because I returned to eating some stuff that are off-limit in keto–such as sweet potatoes–in minimal amounts (50 gr max in sweet potato fries I make without oil–air crisp with bacon dripping after pressure cooking) also because as a migraine-brain, that’s trouble for me. But it seems a small amount of these things seems to be good for me in terms of my lipid health.

          insulin resistance risk markers mine
          Large VLDL-P <=2.7 best: <0.9 mine: 0.8
          Small LDL-P <=527 best =4.8 best >7.3 mine: 8.7
          VLDL size <=46.6 best <42.4 mine: 38.6
          LDL size >20.8 best >21.2 mine: 21.1
          HDL size >=9.2 best >9.6 mine: 9
          LP-IR <=45 best <27 mine: <25


        • chris c says:

          Can’t get NMR here. The nurses can only do a cut down test with TChol and a “ratio”, to get the standard panel you have to see a doctor. A lot of people can’t even get trigs, though they have to be measured if the LDL is calculated as it usually is. If you want low LDL go hyperthyroid! It dropped mine by exactly the same amount as the statin I no longer take. Not recommended as heart healthy though!

          I’ve sort of settled down to the fact I am going to be dead soon, fifty years of undiagnosed diabetes is catching up with me now, my arteries are rotting from the periphery inwards. Tim Noakes is spot on in his description of diabetes as “disseminated arterial disease”, though as Malcolm Kendrick has shown it is only one factor that affects the endothelium.

          Enjoy your conference!

          Liked by 1 person

        • Chris, why don;t you reverse your T2D using the ketogenic diet? Millions of people are doing that in the US… it doesn’t even take long. Why suffer? You do have to give up some of the things you are eating.

          I am very scared that the US will head toward that monster socialized medicine. What we have now works perfect and we really should keep it as is. We can get anything done, whatever we want. Priceless!


        • chris c says:

          Oh I have – and for fifteen years now I have had essentially normal BG, BP and lipids. However it is the fifty preceding years, mostly low fat and some vegetarian and briefly vegan, which did the damage that is now catching up with me.

          If I’d continued that I would by now be fat, with fewer than the average number of limbs, and probably already dead. At least I no longer have all the symptoms. I wish I’d been diagnosed earlier and told what to do about it instead of having to find out for myself. I could have had a much better life. I had some TRULY clueless doctors who decided I must be “pretending to be ill for sympathy” despite never getting any. If they chose to look they could have found out what was wrong any time since early childhood. One even remarked on my “weird lipids” – low HDL, high LDL, sky high trigs – then determined I was eating “too much fat” and sent me to a dietician. My lipids got worse and I gained a lot of weight quickly which I’d never done before, and I was accused of “failing to comply” with the diet. No, the diet was failing to comply with me, or a lot of other people.

          Odd isn’t it, they feed pigs on grain and skimmed milk to make them fat, and expect the same thing to make us slim.

          Liked by 1 person

        • You made me laugh with the pigs fed with grains and skim milk to make them fat–cows the same… for some odd reason it doesn’t add up to them that it will do the same for humans.

          I was at a nutrition conference put on my the American College of Nutrition–now part of the American Nutrition Association, which offered a keto certificate course I took a few months ago. I was invited to present a poster. What was interesting is that they offer a course on keto, yet the whole conference was vegetarian–almost vegan! The first day the boxed lunch we all received was “keto” supposedly but there was no fat or meat… only veggies, riced cauliflower, minimal amount of avocado mixed with cucumbers, 6 almonds, and a dozen blueberries… the protein was 1 hard boiled egg. I was lucky and set next to a Hindu vegetarian who doesn’t eat eggs so he gave me his… lol… I starved t death the other days…

          So if this organization is clueless…. what do we expect from the rest of the world?


        • chris c says:

          Scary and ridiculous but not really surprising, the Plant Based creed rules all. I’m surprised they didn’t give you artificial meat and vegan cheese, and official keto diets are usually based on “vegetable” oil rather than healthy saturated fat.

          Liked by 1 person

        • Original keto diets on vegetable oil??? Nah. They are based on fruit oils: coconut, avocado, and olive oil as well as lots of saturated fat. The keto meal was definitely nothing like a keto meal. In terms of fake meat: processed meat. They are very anti processed food, so likely that’s what saved us from that garbage.


    • Roald Michel says:


      When the going gets tough, the tough get going. And guess what? We are the tough ones 😈

      Liked by 1 person

  5. The disadvantage the vegan movement has is rather simple. As more people embrace veganism, more people will gain direct experience of their health worsening. There is a reason few people remain on a vegan diet for very long. So, all we have to do is wait. Keep repeating the truth and wait. Research does show that repeating facts with persistence eventually changes minds. Persistence is key.

    In bringing more attention to their diet, vegans will simultaneously bring attention to the failure of their diet. There is no way for them to avoid this. They have no long term strategy for success because, for most people, veganism offers few health benefits beyond short term results of any diet in getting off a standard American diet. Documentaries like this will have little impact in the big picture and will be quickly forgotten.

    Liked by 1 person

    • While all this is true Benjamin, and I wholeheartedly agree, there are two huge disadvantages that are hidden here and neither is necessarily reversible:

      1) puberty boys believe the penis argument and will go vegan. This will have possible long-term effect on their health. I am glad my boys are grown men and I only have daughters for grandchildren at this point!

      2) Because of the money behind the vegan movement, entire countries mandate vegan food–for example, I think it is in Denmark where parents are not permitted to send meat in the lunch box for children. All school children must eat in school only vegan food. This trend also changes agriculture and the land, and that may have permanent devastating effects. Not to mention government provided food rations to the military–the US now has an obesity problem in the military. Also hospitals–in the US it is all junk and cereal with margarine. And I am scared of senior homes–I am closer to the age of that than anything else… I dread the thought of having to start eating cereal and margarine in my older years!! It’s not far, I am already a senior.

      Hence, what you write, short term, is plausible but not long-term. And, let’s not forget, that the vegan money doesn’t stop pushing!! Nothing will be forgotten. New stuff will come to the surface and trap a few more millions of people and a few more countries.


      • There will be some long term consequences. No doubt about it. Even short term experiments of veganism could lead to permanent harm, especially when the young go vegan while still developing. But such people will act as a warning to others.

        In our collective learning process, many lives will sadly be sacrificed in unhealthy experimentation. There is no way around that. An entire country turning vegan won’t continue that experiment for very long. The mass health decline and public health crisis would be so catastrophic as to be impossible to ignore. In that case, such countries will likewise act as warnings to all others.

        I never said that the situation wouldn’t get worse before it gets better. Even so, no amount of wealth and power can hide the immense costs of veganism, costs for individuals and for society. It won’t be affordable or sustainable. It couldn’t last for very long, although much damage could be done in that short period of time. It will be a costly lesson learned, but reality will teach that lesson no matter what anyone believes or attempts to enforce.

        I’m not optimistic in the short term. I can’t even claim to exactly be optimistic in the long term. It’s just that I don’t see how humanity will be able to avoid learning this lesson. And, in historical terms, I doubt it will take long to learn it. Sure, it will be a bad situation for the present young generation. They will inherit the costs and experience the consequences. Based on that, they will then raise their own children far differently. For reasons of survival, they will be forced to go a different dietary path.

        I don’t see it playing out in any other way. Either that or civilization would collapse. Healthcare alone would bankrupt society and create a crippled population that couldn’t maintain an advanced civilization. No one has ever built a functioning society on veganism and no one ever will. That won’t necessarily stop some people from trying. And many other factors such as climate crises could contribute to mass hysteria and mass dysfunction. We might go into a tailspin that we won’t be able to pull out of.

        As I said, I’m not Mr. Sunshine. My only point is reality can be brutal in teaching us lessons. We won’t continue very far down this “plant-based” path of industrial agriculture and processed foods. Vegans are banking on techno-utopian solutions, but I don’t see humanity being saved in this manner.

        Liked by 1 person

        • I wouldn’t agree with you more. I particularly liked these sentences: “Either that or civilization would collapse. Healthcare alone would bankrupt society and create a crippled population that couldn’t maintain an advanced civilization.” I think both of these are on their way as we write.

          Healthcare is bankrupt in all countries where social medicine rules. The US is still not there but should a Democrat win, the US follows the healthcare crisis of the UK and Canada. The civilization is not yet collapsed but is starting to in many ways–though way of eating may not be at the core of that. I think that humans are starting to show that they have lived past their welcome on this planet.

          My undergraduate degree is in mathematics and while I have forgotten most everything I have learned, one thing I never forgot: the predator-pray graph in which the balance must be maintained else there is a constant death of pray and then the predator dies for lack of pray, which then brings the pray back alive, which then gives rise to the growth of the predators again…

          While humans have no “predators” in the same sense as this mathematical game, similarly how a single bacteria can outlive its welcome in a Petri dish because of the toxic environment it creates, so are humans in this Petri dish we call Earth, and earth itself creates the predator-pray scenario. Humanity will not be saved–in time earth will be engulfed by the sun–in fact the entire solar system will be put out. We merely could enjoy our stay, or make it miserable.

          Looking back at the short span of human civilization, we are really good at making it miserable. 😦

          Liked by 1 person

        • chris c says:

          “The mass health decline and public health crisis would be so catastrophic as to be impossible to ignore. In that case, such countries will likewise act as warnings to all others.”

          Er . . . that already happened from low fat diets. Veganism is just doubling down on stupid.

          They have the religious certainty of the Seventh Day Adventists backed by huge quantities of money from “food” manufacturers, drug companies and agrochemical and seed suppliers. What could possibly go wrong?

          I live among Big Arable farms. Stinky Season has just passed – they spread ANIMAL MANURE on the fields to grow all that vegan heart healthy wheat and rape (canola) . When that is no longer available they will have to use synthetics. They don’t manure every field every year and you can see the difference from the numbers of gulls and crows on the manured fields catching worms and insects.so that will come to an end. They do use (digested) human ordure but there are restrictions on its use – not carrots, peas or onions for example.

          The farmers grazing cows and sheep have no need for 400hp tractors, 600hp combines or sprayers with their toxic contents, by comparison it is low input farming not to mention tasty and healthy. Much of the grazing is done on land that cannot be cropped.

          I have no doubt Veganworld is coming and it won’t be pretty either in terms of health or the environment. Fortunately I am too old to see it happen but I feel sorry for the children especially. Most seed-eating birds are genetically adapted but still feed their young on insects because they need the fat and protein. The few that don’t have stunted young that spend ,much longer in the nest until they are ready to fly. There’s a lesson there for vegan parents.

          I bookmarked this hilarious thread

          Liked by 1 person

        • lol Chris on the link.

          Indeed, the big experiment #1 has been on since Ancel Keys and that already failed but it seems that short of a few percent of the global population, the majority have not learned their lessons from it. Now comes experiment #2 and that will end humans as a species.

          I hope I am old enough to not see the veganworld come. I must apologize for my children and grandchildren. It woudl have been better to not have children. They will be the ones suffering from the vulnerable gullible and the money-smart bastards. Nothing we can do about it because the change this time will likely be irreversible.


        • Roald Michel says:

          Re: “……..because the change this time will likely be irreversible.” Oh come on, it’s not all gloom and doom, Angela! There always will be people sticking to their meat meals. Me for instance. So, while the plant people will die in the end and thus have solved the problems coming with an overcrowded planet, “we” will survive and establish a brand new society. Prophet Ro says: The future is bright 🌞

          Liked by 1 person

        • It’s not that simple Roald. Where you are, you are safe. In several Northern European countries they completely plan to stop producing meat and, like I wrote somewhere, in Denmark I believe, parents are not permitted to send meat with the kid to school for lunch. They must all always eat vegan diet. In some of these same countries, while milk is still available, only low fat or skimmed milk. No whole milk. Some countries go crazy over these new “ideas” without any examination of the outcome–lots of financial incentives.

          I can see a time in many of these places where meat just simply will not be an option to purchase. And while some animals will always be an option for some people in some places, most will have no such option. I think that individual choice will be gone. It is already happening.

          In terms of “we will survive”… if these idiots destroy all the soil and all the animals that make it alive, it will take too long for one generation to reset the planet with animals again–if at all that’s possible. In the US, already, you can sit in my yard and perhaps see 1 bird in an hour. How many do you see where you live? And I live in the suburbs surrounded by big estates and “wild parks”.. and 1 bird every now and then… I used to have snails!!! This is the first year I saw no snails either. I used to have so many bees that it was hard to get near some of my flowers to sniff them… now I can count how many bees are in my yard–I think about 30. And I don;t use any insecticide in my yard and no one does in my neighborhood… where are the birds? I even have a feeder.

          Where are the bugs? This was the first June without a June bug. One June bug flew into my bedroom 2 days ago! In November!? Where are the flies??? This year I so far saw about 5 flies?! really? Come-on… this is not normal.

          The future is bright indeed…. the sun will grow to be a giant alright lol. I don’t see a happy future for humanity. I see the vegans killing off all animals with their wish of not killing any. And when the animals are gone, so will people. I just hope to die before this happens.


        • Roald Michel says:

          You can always move to Aruba, Angela. In my yards there are plenty bees, bugs, iguanas, birds, crickets, wasps, ants, you name it. Even cockroaches have their regular parties here. And there’s a mother hummingbird, trying to chase me from her home within which her two youngsters are goofing off nowadays. Of course, I continue my talks with salamanders and lizards. Lilith and Jesus are visiting too. When the three of us are talking about humanity, we all are loao 🎭

          Re: Meat. The problem is, we import most of that stuff. But we have pigs and chicken of our own. Guess we have to expand the meat industry. Anyway, I think the future is still bright for a few of us 😈

          Note: Today I had fish. Tomorrow spareribs. The day after, liver. Then it’s steak’s turn. In between, salmon, herring, and bacon. And of course I take my magnesium every day 😛

          Liked by 1 person

        • lol, one day I may stop in Aruba to visit you. I am thinking about moving to other places but the problem is that the kids are staying so that’s not a solution. Not sure how life would be without beef! 😉 I am playing with the idea of moving Down Under. Love Australia and New Zealand is the most beautiful place on the planet. And they are the beef and lamb capital of the world, not likely to disappear any time soon.

          You probably have way better tasking pigs and chicken than we do. In the US they feed pigs to be skinny… yet the craziest thing I have heard. We eat pork from pigs that are medicated to be skinny and beef that are fed corn and soy to be fat… what a reversed world.

          With all this stuff going on, the benefit to me tonight was lost appetite for dinner and I won’t eat till dinner tomorrow so pulling a fasting day out of spite. That works. 🙂

          Enjoy your talk to mother hummer. I still have hummers in my yard because I grow plants for them. That’s the only bird I can see nests and eggs from every year.

          Cockroaches? My neighbors may have eaten them ‘cuz I have not seen one of them critters either come to think of it. Also the crickets are missing this year. Funny how it feels as you discover what’s missing and you realize how the world is changing right under your foot every single minute of the day.


        • Roald Michel says:

          Re: “Funny how it feels as you discover what’s missing………..” You can say that again. Every day when I wake up I’m missing her, And then it lingers on till I go to bed again. Horrible plight I tell you.

          Liked by 1 person

        • chris c says:

          We’re lucky here, despite all the massive arable agriculture there are still plenty of birds and insects. The populations have changed though, partly from agrochemicals and partly from climate change, as some species are declining and dying out so others are coming in. Interestingly there have been increases in many predators like hawks and owls. I knew someone who was researching small mammal populations and found the highest numbers in sheep fields. Many of the arable guys plant wildflowers around the field margins which provides food for insects and birds, not just the pheasants and partridges which make a second food crop.

          I was just walking among the fields at twilight hearing the wild calls of golden plover, which breed on the high hills and heather-clad moors up north and winter on the southern estuaries and farmland. Barn owls are common but I didn’t see or hear one – when there are a lot of voles they only come out to hunt after dark.

          Veganworld will require even more agrochemicals and synthetic fertilisers which may well reverse this. As you say, iin attempting to “save” animals they are killing them through their ignorance of ecology.

          Liked by 2 people

        • And we have a predatory bird moving here as well. I forgot its name by now. I chased it away all day long for 3 weeks a couple of months or so ago and so it is not here anymore. It is a beautiful bird with its tail 3 times the size of the bird. Lovely colors too. It chased all my birds away from the feeder and it is also the type that lays its eggs into other birds’ nests and so it kills off native species… Since I chased that male off, I have seen very few birds.

          One bird population spent their summer on my feeder, which is a very rare bird: Nutmeg Mannikin https://ca.audubon.org/news/nutmeg-mannikin-added-california-state-list that used to be only in two places in the world: Hong King (native) and Los Angeles (no one knows how). This Los Angeles group started to come to my feeder about 10 years ago. And I can see that in 2013 they added this bird to be on the list for California… I love them. They are also called “Spice Finch” and used to be sold in stores for sale. No longer! I love watching them and the whole house goes tip-toe when they are around.


        • Roald Michel says:

          Your bird: Long-tailed paradise whydah?

          Liked by 1 person

        • I think it is the pin-tailed Whydah. It looked like this: http://southafrica.co.za/pin-tailed-whydah.html Beautiful bird but annoying to native species.


        • chris c says:

          Wow cute!

          When I was young we had swallows nesting in our garden shed and whitethroats in all the hedges and scrub. Then in 1968 the Sahel desert opened up (long before climate change!) and these transsaharan migrants failed to make the crossing.

          The whitethroats have now returned and I think now they are even commoner than they were, probably because they have taken to living in rape (canola) fields, and they have probably altered their migration. I’ve had them in the hedge and this year they nested in the garden. The male was singing to his reflection in my back door, but he did find a mate. If I put the dining room light on after dark he would wake up and start singing!

          When I was young kites were very rare, only found on a couple of mountains in Wales. There was a reintroduction programme further west and south and they have now made the rest of the way on their own. There was a famous map back in the sixties that showed the distribution of buzzards to the north and west and gamekeepers to the south and east but now they are no longer being shot they have also made it here. The old organochlorine pesticides did for a lot of birds of prey which have finally returned – peregrines used to nest on cliffs but have adapted to city buildings and church towers. Vegan chemicals could see them off again.

          Some changes don’t appear to have any rhyme or reason though, red backed shrikes are pretty much extinct in the UK but are still common in Europe. Some things have come up from the south, some from the west and others from the east while others have declined, it’s a complicated picture which chemical laced monocrops and the loss of grasslands and grazing animals aren’t going to help.

          Liked by 1 person

        • Funny that I just wrote this yesterday and today I was watching this bird family on my feeder. The only birds that tolerate other birds–of their own kind–on the feeder at once, so 4 were eating and chattering away. Very cute. 🙂


        • chris c says:

          Yesterday I walked along by the river through the park and nature reserve on the edge of town. I saw at least three, probably four, water voles. Another thing that used to be common when I was young. One reason for their decline was that “animal liberationists” released a load of mink into the wild.. They are not native here, their only predator is man and they eat everything. They also outcompeted otters, which are native, and greatly impeded their return. After a couple of decades the mink have finally been trapped out and other things are able to return and increase their populations.

          Liked by 1 person

        • Very sad. Are you on Facebook? I just posted something about the Seventh-day Adventists and veganism by Belinda Fettke: https://www.facebook.com/AngelaAStantonPhD


        • chris c says:

          I thought you were exaggerating with the Denmark thing – I found an article where they were going to make vegan ALTERNATIVES mandatory. Well most restaurants and pubs here provide vegetarian and vegan alternatives for financial reasons. They don’t actually list low carb/keto/paleo meals but you can usually cobble something together.

          I thought “when the camel gets its nose into the tent . . .” then found the article where they are now trying to ban meat. Cambridge University had already banned beef and lamb from their canteens and now Norwich University is following suit. I’ve heard of parents in the US and UK being censured or fined for not providing grains in their children’s meals, and kids being forced to eat crackers. I remember a military PT instructor complaining that since they fed pasta in the field canteens he’d never had so many fat and unfit soldiers. These people HAVE to follow the Food Pyramid, and the Vegan Pyramid is on its way.

          I also found this


          Moby, that well known expert in canine physiology, wants all animal shelters to feed their dogs a vegan diet. Hang on, aren’t these people supposed to be against animal abuse? Coming shortly, feeding lions on fruit . . .

          Liked by 1 person

        • I wish this blog allowed an angry face on a post… it is sickening to read all the bad things happening. 😦 I am really scared that they will destroy all people and the earth as well. 😦 Mighty mad! And, indeed! There is a vegan animal movement. It should be a felony to abuse animals like that.


      • Roald Michel says:

        You will never end up in a senior home 😛 Neither will I 😈

        Liked by 1 person

        • heh.. one never knows though I have made a commitment to remove myself from the planet before that happens–but shit happens..


        • Roald Michel says:

          If that shit would happen to you, I’m sure you would reorganize that senior home in no time😈
          For the same reason a judge has never send me to jail, while Satan already has a MOU with Yahweh, that under no circumstances I will end up in hell 😛

          Liked by 1 person

        • lol, I most certainly would try to reorganize that nursing home. . Unfortunately I will be (would be, could be) the underdog with some condition where I cannot talk.. sad.. we have a state were such life can end legally… one state north of me… no problem 🙂


  6. Roald Michel says:

    Re: “So what are we, enlightened ones, to do? Nothing…” Just remember the adage, “Mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur.”

    Re: “The entire vegan movement is based on lies and look at the number of followers.” It’s all over the place. For instance, looking at what during a democratic election a voter’s vote is based on, I believe, as I once claimed in a LI-article, way too many people love cheating more than honesty.

    Re: ” ………those that were meant to die, such as slaves and prisoners, and those that were meat to win, such as the trained gladiators.” Freudian slip? 😛


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